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TMAllison
06-20-2004, 04:58 PM
My 99 E300 seems to like fuel additives, typically idling quieter and getting slightly better mileage than without.

I have expirimented with adding ~1% of B100 and get the same results.

I would like to run straight B100 occasionally and am curious if other board members with 98 or 99 Turbo's do so successfully; and if so:

How long they have done so?

Whether or not they have have had any mechanical issues they could attribute to use of B100?

Finally, does the 99 use the "viton" rubbers in fuel related lines, hoses, o-rings etc?

Like most other E300 TD owners, I don't want to go through another round of air infiltration into the fuel system.

TomJ
06-21-2004, 05:37 PM
Can't speak from direct experience with the 99's, but as the "un-official" mech for Boulder Biodiesel, I can give some opinions based on others experience with the newer MB's.

First, the issue with the additives is probably due to the cetane increase. Almost all (if not all) of the OTC additives boost cetane rating by some amount.

Biodiesel has the same effect. It's normal cetane rating is somewhere around 50-55, as much as TEN POINTS above pump diesel.

Running B100 should not present problems, depending on your climate and the quality of the fuel. Most German (Euro in gen'l I would bet) cars that are newer than about 1995 will deal with B100 without issue. Their flexible lines are compatible with BD and most certainly the '99.

Mechanical issues can arise in the DI engines, though many TDI people have zero problems.

My suggestion is to run B20 for a while or even higher (B50) and see how the car acts on that.

Wally
06-24-2004, 12:59 PM
A friend of mine has a 91 or 92 300D and has been experiencing a problem starting after the car is warm sometimes. It needs to be cranked for longer than ususal or it'll only catch on the second attempt. I suspected air getting in and then read your post. Could you describe the symptoms/solution for this car? or link to a page that does?

BTW, I entirely agree with what TomJ stated and would og one step further to iterate the fact that biodiesel is a 100% replacement for petro-diesel fuel. Yes, there can be issues with older cars and rubber seals but I owned an 81 rabbit and 84 vovlo 760 that both got over 30k miles on B100 and neither of them ever showed any signs of degredation on the fuel system by the fuel - in fact it was quite the opposite.

turbobiodiesel
06-27-2004, 07:26 PM
Experience with the E300 on B100 is just starting it seems. Randall von Wedel has had a 98 on B100 since Feburary, I have a 95 since March and John Ketcham has a 98 for a couple of months. In my case I have only 4,000 miles on B100, compared to the 26,000 B100 miles on my 84 300D. The good news is that of yet we have had no problems. Take care of the car by using ASTM D6751 fuel and as a precaution I filter my fuel to 4 microns from the drum, or rely on the 10m at the pump.

TMAllison
07-03-2004, 04:12 PM
Wally,

I think your question concerning air in the fuel lines was directed to me.

The 606.9xx's use clear plastic fuel lines to feed the IP (x6 or 7). Each has a o-ring seal with a plastic clip system to make the {weak}connection. Most owners expirience air in the lines within 100k miles.

The usual problem is difficulty starting (have to manually crank engine 30 seconds to prime IP), ragged idle or stalling while driving (IP, while efficient at removing air, can't overcome volume present in lines).

A bright flashlight will usually allow you to see any bubbles with the motor running; this becomes more difficult with age as line yellow.

Note: when shut down fuel WILL drain from line connecting the Pre-Filter (located in fuel filter housing) back toward the feul thermostat mounted in the cyl head. Also, some air is usually present in the U-shaped line connected beneath the fuel shut-off solenoid to the ffuel pump at the rear of the IP; in mine the amount of air increases with RPM.

Replacement of the lines and o-ring for the pre-filter (separte part number) is fairly easy. The lines cost USD $70 or $80. The o-rings are all that need tto be replaced; of course MB only sells the complete line. The o-rings are metric and fat lil buggers given their small diameter and need to be fuel resisant; I gave up trying to match them and bought the lines.

The intake mainifold makes hard it hard to get your arm in there to work; on mine removal of the windsheild washer resisvor allowed access.

bkj_90_300D
07-09-2004, 05:30 PM
TMA,
I am the friend of Wally w/ the starving turbodiesel. It sounds like the arrangement of my 90 602.962 is a bit different than your 606. The prefilter is alone inline prior to the preheater and spin-on final filter. I think the problem is the same however. Now to just find the root cause. Part of the problem is it is intermitent. Although it does only seem to occur when the outside temperature is aproaching or in excess of 90 deg F and the car has recently been at operating temperature. Then just as you describe, it is as if the system is priming. I have intentions of taking a look at the fittings near and adjacent ot the spin on and IP. Thanks for the help and if you have any other recomendations they would be greatly appreciated.

Brian
90 300d 2.5 turbo
B100 Homebrew since March 2004

bkj_90_300D
07-09-2004, 05:52 PM
TMA,
To address YOUR inquiry, I HAve been running B100 for the past 3+ months. Short of the fuel related problem you are up to speed on (which I am convinced is not related to my fuel) I have not had any problems that can be as a result of B100. I have had to change the return hoses at the injectors as they were weeping, most likely due to the combination of them being brittle from 13 years of hot and cold and my fuel. I've had new MB hoses for about 1500 miles/6 weeks now and no sign of problems.

On the subject of the Viton/synthetic rubbers in MB products. One avvenue I am going to persue myself is with the manufacturer of my MB's fuel pump (Bosch). MB service manuals give a detailed account of, at minimum, the manufacturers model numbers of the products in the cars. Perhaps this is an avenue you can pursue to reassure your on the right path.

TMAllison
07-25-2004, 04:22 PM
Brian,

Didnt realize you had a 2.5 Turbo; it is very different than my 99. I had one a few years ago. A very flexible fun engine. Mine unfortunately had vaccum issues that turned off the turbo whenever it got warmed up; never could figure out what was wrong and finally got tired of the dealer throwing new parts at it and got rid of it.

The 606.962 turbo is quite an improvement and I recommend it to any diesel lover.

I would recommend you join Mercedesshop.com. I have had great success locating and asking for advice on that forum. The moderators of the forum are some of the most technically knowlegable mechanics around and have the full factory resources available them. They are quite willing to share their expertise.

Alex04032
11-25-2006, 05:51 PM
<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-title">quote:</div><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-content">Mercedesshop.com </div></BLOCKQUOTE>
My 98 MB E300td started leaking just a little fuel after 90,000 and runing about six months on b100. Seriously rough running and intermittantly, too. After research in the forums, Im convinced its air leaks at the o-rings and Ill be changing them all out this week.

Im not sure if b100 caused this, or just the poor connection design which apparently is known for leaking.

jddimo
01-27-2007, 06:17 PM
I just bought a 98 300TD & want to run it on WVO/SVO & biodiesel. Live in Boston & have COLD winters. Car parked outside. Need advice on system/conversion/kit to use - one (Elsbett) or two tank system & any other useful info!!

THanks for the input!

-John

GO_MB_300D
01-28-2007, 03:47 PM
The fuel lines on the 606 engines have o-rings that are the cause of many problems. The o-rings go bad over time. One frequently forgotten (an I have been there) is the oring under the pre-filter. I have never had problems with the fuel system as a result of biodiesel and I have ran my 1999 E300 over 7,000 straight miles on B100.

GreasyFireman
03-03-2007, 10:52 PM
Just thought I would drop my 2 cents.The wifes 98 e 300td loved 80% bio 20% wvo blend for over 15k miles before being wrecked.I think the wreck was a result of the 20% wvo not the biodiesel.

GreasyFireman
03-05-2007, 01:36 AM
Now that everyone has read this and started talking!It was a 95 lincoln that wrecked it!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

Shaman
03-05-2007, 03:37 AM
Has anyone found a way to bypass or redo the fuel lines, like a fitting and regular hose?

long4trails
08-15-2007, 01:03 AM
<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-title">quote:</div><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-content">Originally posted by turbobiodiesel:
Experience with the E300 on B100 is just starting it seems. Randall von Wedel has had a 98 on B100 since Feburary, I have a 95 since March and John Ketcham has a 98 for a couple of months. In my case I have only 4,000 miles on B100, compared to the 26,000 B100 miles on my 84 300D. The good news is that of yet we have had no problems. Take care of the car by using ASTM D6751 fuel and as a precaution I filter my fuel to 4 microns from the drum, or rely on the 10m at the pump. </div></BLOCKQUOTE>

I like running BQ-9000 B99.9 in my CTD and may look for an E300D. So how have these 300Ds faired over time? I have read of issues with the o-rings and fuel lines, but it is not clear that the issue is related to biodiesel. What has your experience been?

Regards,
Joe